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Thread: Which CCR???

  1. #11
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    Thanks for the info guys.... I've actually heard good things about the Sport KISS.

    I'll keep you posted when I finally make a decision....

  2. #12
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    Hi Dave,

    I can confirm a few professional underwater, photographers and videographers use KISS (both Sport and Classic) rebreathers for their work. I should know, I am one of them, along with Norbert Wu, Curt Bowen, Alan Studley, Doug Ebersole and Tim Taylor.

    Flying manual (KISS) CCR’s is very easy. I started off with an Inspiration Classic only to switch to a Sport KISS few years back.

    If you are not of the notion that “I am too busy to properly monitor my displays and dive computer” then you should be fine with it.

    As a underwater photographer (see www.waltstearns.com and www.underwaterjournal.com) diving a KISS has almost become second nature for me too balance between shooting pictures reading the information through the camera’s viewfinder and maintaining my desired set point at 1.2. Even in task loading situations, like shooting a bag midway up from the bottom on a 140 dive in a live boat situation while judging your camera, monitor depth/time/PO2 with 10 to 15 min. of deco to full fill) is no big deal.

    Many MCCR users attribute regular monitoring and adjustment through manual injection builds safer habits, reducing the likelihood that a malfunction would go unnoticed. Furthermore, in addition to offer the user a better chance at remedying a gas management issue underwater, they (KISS) are simple to repair in the field, and reducing the prospects of missing a dive or whole dive trip. There are few components on a KISS that cannot be taken apart with a small cresset wrench and Philips screwdriver.

    In addition to the original KISS triple display and VR pendant, KISS has decided to offer both Classic and Sport without any displays what so ever.

    Now some of you, knowing displays for PO2 monitoring is a critical component to all rebreathers are going to say what, are you nuts! Well, Kim has just spent plenty of time with her lawyer to make this happen, and to ensure that divers understand the risk. Those that want this option will have to sign an additional waiver. Also this option will only be avialable through the dealers.

    What's great about this is that divers can choose from a variety of options such as computers like the VRx, Shearwater Pursuit and Liquidvision X1, as well as more simple triple displays like Subsea and Sartek which are capable of monitor three O2 cells, thus permitting an individual making the investment in a Classic or Sport not be totally beholden to those devices offered by KISS.

    What this all means is that a diver wanting to get into a KISS, can have the dealer order it without any displays, while at the same time buy the displays and/or computer of their choice from that dealer. In theory, what you opt to plumb into it is entirely up to you. Of course, the rebreather must be checked to see everything is in working order, particularly in the matter that computer/displays plugged in are reading the three O2 cells properly. A prudent behavior that should practiced by all rebreather divers.

    The retail price for the Classic KISS, with NO display system (plate and wires note included), runs $5,500 Canadian, or $4,670.75 U.S. dollars at todays exchange rate. Or for $5,950 Canadian, 5,052.90 U.S. will include the kidney plate with a Fischer connection.

    The same goes for the Sport KISS, (minus both the wires and three hose connector) retailing for $4,375 Canadian, $3,715.37 U.S., with NO display system, or for additional $475 Canadian, $403.39 U.S. the unit will come with Fischer connector in O2 sensor housing.
    Walt Stearns
    Publisher/Editor of the Underwater Journal

  3. #13
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    I hear from lots of Kiss owners they are really pleased with their units. I personally am into macro videography so I am always intently looking for tiny critters, and when I spot one, I get into a total concentration zone...maybe that is good for videography, bad for rebreather monitoring, lol.

    It is the Vision electronic's HUD always in front of my left eyeball that eliminates me from having to constantly check my po2, let alone periodically inject 02. I have no idea how often you Kiss owners actually have to inject 02 or visually monitor their p02 readout other than the standard on the books 60 seconds of the Classic Inspo dangling pendants, so perhaps some can chime in.

    I was never a fan of their triple LCD readout pendant, but as Walt alluded to, now that I have seen for several years an interface with VR3's and other integrated p02 computers, that is no longer an issue.

    I suspect that there is a certain level of familiarity and thus comfort with doing video on the unit you learned and were trained on, sort of like the Ford v Chevy argument.

    I would prefer an HUD though with a small TV style screen like Pete Readey had on some of his Prism units. Far more info available, as this stuff about memorizing what all the different LED codes mean on the Vision HUD is for the birds.

    By the way, I would not be doing video at 150' on any unit with a 3 liter or less onboard diluent cylinder at 150' without a slung bailout bottle.


    Ultimately, features aside, the best rebreather for anyone is the one they feel the most comfortable with.
    SMN Publisher

  4. #14
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    Very good point there. As for HUD options, they can be added to any system. Currently I use Shearwater Pursuit with one of the original KISS displays (as a back up to the Shearwater) for PPO2 monitoring. If/when I choose too, I can easily jack in a Shearwater's HUD system with no difficulty at all.

    As to the question how often us Kiss owners actually have to inject 02 or visually monitor your p02 readout.

    Visually monitoring our p02 is the same as with any other rebreather out there. What's the mantra "know your PO2 at all times or you will die." Yeah, sounds harsh, but it keeps you thinking.

    As for how often us Kiss owners actually have to inject 02 into the system, that really depends on depth and activity level.

    The KISS works by bleeding O2 into the system at a rate of .06 lpm (just below the average human being's metabolic rate), with a manual bypass button punch a quick or long shot of O2 back into the loop.

    I can't speak for everyone (KISS Divers) here, but not very often as I have somewhat low SAC rate (close to .5) and can maintain very efficient breathing rate, even when task loaded. Dive the system as long as have, tapping the button is as automatic and second nature as stroking your fingers through your hair or scratching your chin.

    When I doing something like shooting macro, or simply laying in wait for something, to maintain a setpoint of 1.2, the drop is so low, at a depth of 40 - 50 feet the flow rate is dam near equal to my metabolic rate. At 60 feet and deeper, it actually moves in the other direction, ticking up faster with each increase in depth, requiring I have pay very close attention to not letting it get too high.
    Walt Stearns
    Publisher/Editor of the Underwater Journal

  5. #15
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    Reasonable low maintenance (well compared to other units I know there is a fair amount of work involved)
    Size
    Safety Record (Pretty high on my list!!)
    Fairly easy to get serviced etc
    ??

  6. #16
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    Default Sentinel

    What I learned at DEMA, the Sentinel is the best bang for the buck.
    With training, around $12K.
    http://www.technologyindepth.com/sentinel.html

    L
    Lars

    Explore, understand, protect
    "Let's go Diving"

  7. #17
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    They say they have realtime C02 sensing too.
    SMN Publisher

  8. #18
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    Default CO2 sensor

    I could be wrong.....but I believe the Apoc is the only one with CO2 sensor....and it's still vapour-ware at this stage, since there are no deliveries yet.

    Chrispy

  9. #19
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    I interviewed the Closed Circuit Research guys and they definitely say they have real time C02 sensing on the Sentinel.

    I have seen the Apoc's separate C02 module...but yes, I too haven't seen it out there.
    SMN Publisher

  10. #20
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    For me the choice was simple, the APD factory is a 30 minute drive from my house.

    I have dived the Pelagian and found that to be very easy, compact and light for travelling.

    New APD cells out soon as well, 4 year life span but twice the price of teledynes.

    CO2 monitoring, if you don't try to out-run your scrubber you don't need one.
    For PSAI/SSI/SDI/TDI Diver Training or RHIB Charter in Cornwall visit - Atlantic Scuba

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