But ... but before you said:Originally Posted by Papa Bear
My point was they DO show up with just the sound of the boat. So they are being conditioned to that behaviour by the intervention and introduction of stimulus by man.
-- "I'd like to be ... under the sea ... In an octopus' garden ... in the shade ..."
Not always and just the more curious, but there still is no association with us! Stand by what I said! I have seen sharks show up just because there was a boat and I have not seen them in the same place the next time, otherwise chum would only be required for a little while not the 20 years they have been doing it!
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Reed's Rod dive Tool Please help save the worlds Coral reefs! http://safemooringfoundation.org/
I am sure
I am sure I, would have something to say. Except after all the back and forth of who said what. I forgot what was said.
"From birth, man carries the weight of gravity on his shoulders. He is bolted to earth. But man has only to sink beneath the surface and he is free.”
Jacque Cousteau
Yes, always. That is why some outfits do "shark dives" on those sites without doing "feeding" dives. They can guarantee their customers will see sharks because the sharks are so conditioned they ALWAYS begin circling when the boat arrives. They continue to do so at least until the boat leaves!
You say that you "stand by what you said", which was that if conditioning were the case "sharks would show up with just the boat showing up and they don't!". Then you agree "Not always and just the more curious", and I know that they always do. The case I'm making is that right or wrong, the feeding by humans conditions their behaviour, like it does in other species of animals on both land and sea all over the world. I don't think you can just dogmatically say otherwise when the evidence supports this fact. But I think the real discussion is what are the pros and cons of it? What are the safety concerns and how can they be mitigated? Does it increase the danger and is it to a level that is unacceptable?
-- "I'd like to be ... under the sea ... In an octopus' garden ... in the shade ..."
And sometimes they don't show up! A condition based on curiosity of a noise that they may associate with possible food posses no threat to man (Divers) that I can see or has been documented! The mere fact that sharks are in the ocean is not a threat even with a food source in the area. Years of Shark Diving and feeding bares this out! Your just another "Thing" Showing up!
May all your dreams be wet ones!
Reed's Rod dive Tool Please help save the worlds Coral reefs! http://safemooringfoundation.org/
I agree with you, that is the real question.
As far as the sharks are concerned, it is probably a REALLY good thing for so many reasons. The biggest reason in my opinion is that these feeding dives raise awareness of sharks as something other than a danger to us and bring travelers to see them which stimulates the local economy for much longer than shark finning can. In those areas they have more value alive than they do dead.
The benefits of diving with sharks (wether with or withouth shark feeds), in terms of tourism, longevity and sustainability, are IMHO undeniable, especially when compared with shark fishing or finnning.
However I do have a question on this (and before any hot heads start spouting, it is a question, I'd be very interested to know what people feel).
Tourism etc will potentially bring in extra money to the local economy, but does this extra money reach the right pockets?
The initial operations are generally set up by foreigners with the investment potential and the know how, one would hope that they employ local help and also that the local economy is stimulated and has an overall benefit. So all being as we'd hope, no prob there.
But what about the fishermen, i.e. people who would otherwise potentially be involved in shark finning or fishing. Are they encouraged/helped to move across, is there enough work to provide for them too? If they are and there is, then this would have obvious benefits for the fight against shark finning, however a recent event in South Africa started making me think about it there.
Aliwal Shoals in South Africa has a thriving shark dive industry, reknown, in the UK at least, as one of the best spots in the world - you can get to see black tips, raggy tooths, coppers, duskies, bulls, tigers, as well as regular whale and dolphin sitings. This brings in loads of tourists and loads of money (quick plug, a good friend of mine, Craig, runs excellent tours around there, including an anual to participate in the sardine run, and also shark feeds if that's your thing. PM me if you're interested).
Despite this, a fishermen went out and caught 3 tiger sharks in February, landed them in broad day light and sold them. His reason, apparently he was up against the wall, fish stocks were low and he couldn't find another way to feed his familly, he received no direct benefot from the shark diving industry - fishing for the sharks, known regulars to the area, was an easy and obvious option to him with a good rate of return.
Unfortunately that is what happens when a species (humans) overpopulate. We are using up all of our natural resources at an alarming rate. I feel bad for the poor fisherman, but in reality they are the ones that have fished the ocean clean. There have been many rules set into place to help protect these animals, but the fishermen don't follow the rules and do what they want anyway, then they wonder why there are no fish left.
I know it is harsh, but remember we are not the ones going extinct.....well not yet that is.
. . . . . . . . wow . . . .
-- "I'd like to be ... under the sea ... In an octopus' garden ... in the shade ..."
As with most things in life there is an associated risk! We need to stop and think and then be free to decide for ourselves if that risk is worth it! No one, and I mean no one should be made to go on a shark dive!The benefit is to the local economy for sure, but the bigger benefit is to the understanding of the fish and that fish as a sustainable resource! Many third world counties never thought of their reef systems that way until the dive industry moved in and showed the local government that it was better to bring tourist dollars into the country than fish the reef out and see it's destruction! Risk assessment in life is front line for man to expand his world and has always been their even when the Vikings set sail for the new world! I am glade all explorers understand this concept!
May all your dreams be wet ones!
Reed's Rod dive Tool Please help save the worlds Coral reefs! http://safemooringfoundation.org/
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